Second Life As Popular As World Of Warcraft, Except For The Number Of People

Posted on December 7, 2006 by Scott Jennings| 29 Comments

Matt Mihaly gets credit for finding it, I’m just going to point and laugh.

“World of Warcraft touts a six million or larger active user base – but they shard their world off into smaller servers so you never see 16,000 people in the same place”, said Mr Miller.

“That’s unlike Second Life, where tonight you will see 16,000 people enjoying exactly the same world all able to communicate with each other, all attending the same live music event should they wish to.”

Bear in mind the quoted is Linden Labs’ VP of Technology. So he’s not being clueless – he’s lying through his teeth. SL’s capacity for events is around 75, or less since avatars that are, um, “fully functional” tend to stress out the server with their twiddly scripts. I discussed this earlier with the Mark Warner visit. Wagner James Au, Second Life’s unofficially official ambassador of fun, popped in the comments of that thread to say that the technical limit is around 100, or 200 if you cluster servers.

Note that all of these numbers are considerably less than 16,000. And even if you go with the 100 estimate, that is by far the lowest social capacity of ANY MMO ever released. Most MMOs tend to melt at around a few hundred users in the same space. World of Warcraft usually sees around a hundred or so in each of its main cities at peak hours.

Or maybe he’s just talking about single servers vs world shards. Most world shards cap out at 5,000 or so simultaneous connections (sometimes more depending on demand)… but that’s more to design considerations than hardware for most games. You don’t WANT 8,000 people in Ironforge, do you? And of course, Eve Online just posted 32,000 concurrent users. Which is, for those of you weak at math like Linden’s VP of Technology, roughly double Second Life’s concurrency. Clearly this means Eve Online is MORE popular than World of Warcraft. Told you they were hardcore.

That’s not to say that SL doesn’t do cool things. It does. And it’s a good start at where social MMOs should go. But given the amount of media love and concurrent scrutiny, slapping the market leader with your SL marketplace-purchased “attachment” should only be done if, you know, you can back your attachment up. With, you know. Facts.

(Of course the BBC took his statements credulously. Research is hard.)

Edit: You think I’m mad? Check out A Clockwork Mind, who makes my backlash look positively cooing:

I want to stop seeing stories about Second Life.\’c2\~ I want reputable journalists to stop making themselves look like brown-nosing paid spokesmen for something which is frankly a waste of everyone’s time except those who like to masturbate at the keyboard while looking at furries and little kids.

One day, Jack Thompson and the public at large are going to find about Second Life and when they do, every online environment is going to be in deep, deep trouble because of what Second Life has allowed, no, encouraged, to go on in their systems.

Second Life Must Die.

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  • http://www.thisisnotacommunity.org D-0ne

    Second life must die.

  • http://www.edgecase.net/devsite Cael

    You’re absolutely right i’m mad, Scott. I’m building a sandbox game where people will be able to craft pretty much anything they like.

    For that reason alone, Second Life is a clear and present danger to the project i’m working on. It doesn’t matter that we’ll be moderating creation Habbo-style. It doesn’t matter how well-behaved anyone is in that game.

    Everything the ignorant public are scared by is right there in Second Life and they encourage it. It doesn’t matter that the game/VW itself is a piece of crap, all that matters is SL Escorts and “age play”.

    Second Life must die before it kills us all.

  • http://www.edgecase.net/devsite Cael

    Incidentally, my bet stands. $500 of my own money to anyone who can prove that the majority of people who download clients log into SL more than once.

  • VPellen

    That’s a pretty weak bet, Cael. I don’t think there’s any free-to-access online world, anywhere, where the majority of the people who downloaded the client logged on more than once. But then, maybe that’s your point, I don’t know.

    Second life bores me, quite frankly. I mean it’s great for funky news stories, sure. But to me personally, it just feels too much like a bizarre online mix of b-grade modders, furries, and porn.

    Which, incidentally, is a really good thing. If you like b-grade modders, furries, and porn.

  • guyal

    VPellen, that’s the most accurate description ever made of 2L. I don’t know whether to laugh or cry.

  • http://ve3d.ign.com/ Apache

    new math 4tw

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  • Brent Michael Krupp

    Wasn’t there some Supreme Court (or maybe just Federal Court) decision about “virtual” child porn still counting as actual child porn with regard to criminal prosecution and penalties? So how long until the FBI is subpoenaing Linden Labs and dragging the “age play” pervs off to prison?

  • paul

    When I first heard of SL my thoughts were “This is a joke right?”. Paying someone monthly to have a virtual real life???

  • Wendelius

    @Cael:

    “Incidentally, my bet stands. $500 of my own money to anyone who can prove that the majority of people who download clients log into SL more than once.”

    The majority? Not by any means. But a fair number. And with 365,000 premium accounts, SL is not exactly just a series of never played free account.

    Source: http://secondlife.reuters.com/stories/2006/12/07/surge-in-number-of-avatars-outpaces-sl-usage/

    That being said, while doubling the number of registered users (800K to 1.6M) between September and November is impressive, it’s by no means a reflection of how the game is really growing.

    Wendelius

  • http://www.edgecase.net/devsite Cael

    Wendelius: Then they should not claim them as a population. That’s what we grownups call “lying”.

  • Wendelius

    Cael: I don’t disagree. I think those numbers are not representative of reality (even though you do get a respectable user base by adding up the people who do actually log on as free accounts to those premium ones). But then again, most MMORPGs tend to be very coy about subscription numbers and, if they say anything at all, will certainly not tell you how many of their subscribers are actually actively logging on to their game. At most, they will only tell you ” we have x accounts”.

    I’m one of the people who has nothing against SL and quite enjoy hanging out with friends occasionally, but actually plays more EQ2 these days because the goal driven gameplay with my friends is more fun right now.

    So not really defending SL or anything. Just thought it was a pertinent answer to your question.

    Wendelius

  • http://mythicalblog.com Jeff Freeman

    Second Life lists the current-online numbers on their website. 8k last time I was on.

    But since no one else does, how’s a journalist to know 8k is not a lot, or not?

  • http://mythicalblog.com Jeff Freeman

    Oh yeah:

    And it\’e2\’80\’99s a good start at where social MMOs should go.

    When a journalist breaks the story of how much all the other journalists have been snowed with this PR stuff, there’s going to be bad news for everyone. Or no coverage, even when it really is newsworthy.

    This is assuming they don’t suddenly make a massive amount of money.

    The backlash will be worse for games like SL for a long, long time, if anyone who thinks they’re rich and getting richer, suddenly discovers they aren’t.

  • Numtini

    I have nothing against a sex game like SL, I just object to it being called something that it isn’t.

    As to the numbers. They’re lying. It’s that simple. I watched the numbers over a weekend. They added 46,000 accounts in a day–and never had concurrent logins of over 15k during that time. Sure. I believe that.

  • http://mythicalblog.com Jeff Freeman

    Hm. Googling a bit more now I’m not sure it is for us, to have sex in or otherwise, but rather is for businesses and media to move in to, establish virtual branch offices, etc.

    The intern will have plenty of friends in-game to play with if they’re all 9-to-5 employees paid to be there, too.

    Plenty of press too, if the media realize SL’s potential. I mean, if they’re in there all day with nothing but businesses and other media, what else could they write about?

    Definitely. That game’s not for us, but for multi-million-dollar corporations want to play!

    I even feel a little foolish.

  • http://www.plutospage.com/wow Yunk

    What, you expect journalists to actually CHECK FACTS? And RESEARCH? Are you crazy?

    That responsiblity has been taken over by bloggers. Journalists, esp at places like the Reuters photo wire, BBC, New York Times, and even AP, just parrot the easiest line. I don’t even read papers or watch news anymore.

  • Serpilian

    Second Life may have problems, and certainly they need to start being honest with the press, if not themselves, about accounts, playability an population… but frankly, assuming it’s required to be 18 to play, we really have no business telling them how to run thier game. If consenting adults want to have furry avatars and cyber their little brains out, more power to them. It’s called freedom, mkay? Something I thought we all cared about.

  • http://www.edgecase.net/devsite Cael

    The howling mob only cares about freedom when it’s fried.

  • http://www.edgecase.net/devsite Cael

    @Dundee: EVE lists concurrent users. Checking right now, there are 25,042 individuals online.

    Even a journalist can check that.

  • Darniaq

    It’s about TIME people started looking through SL’s PR. I wouldn’t be surprised if most of whatever money they do collect goes into Marketing.

    My first clue into the disparity between what’s bragged about and the reality is noted here:

    http://www.darniaq.com/wordpress/2006/10/mmo-live/second-life-economist-article/

    Closed it down though, so here’s the Economist article itself:

    http://www.economist.com/science/displaystory.cfm?story_id=7963538

    They don’t jump all over SL. They just note that only about 25k (at the time) were paying anything for it. And that was out of 750k (at the time) “citizens”.

    It’s nice to brag about registered accounts, but that alone does nothing for the bottom line, and therefore by itself isn’t relevant in discussions about business potential.

  • Dellaster

    http://www.camelotherald.com also shows concurrent players for DAoC. A MMOG in decline for years, not considered “big” or “hot” anymore, yet as I write they have over 18,000 people playing. Twice SL’s concurrent players with 100% of them paying money for the privilege. What percentage of SL’s concurrent population is paying, hmm?

    @Serpilian: freedom of speech is also supposed to be something we all care about. If someone has the opinion that SL is like an armed nuclear device; that the fallout from the blast will bring harm to MMOGs in general, and SL-like VWs in particular, because of public reaction once the activities within SL become known; and if that person chooses to express his view in a public forum; that’s okay, isn’t it?

    I’m with Cael: SL should die. Quietly, with a whimper not a bang. Else the whole MMOG industry may suffer the fallout when the currently pet media turns on its master. It matters not a whit if the public is somehow morally wrong for disrespecting the freedom of furries, age-players (unless this is actually illegal as suggested in another comment), or other things going on in SL. The backlash will hurt, nevertheless.

  • Brent Michael Krupp

    Sorry to follow-up too slow on my earlier remark, but I got the Supreme Court case 100% wrong (that’s what I get for being lazy). They actually threw out a federal law that banned “virtual” child porn so Second Life and their pervs are in the clear — “fake” child porn is 100% legal. =(

  • Anon

    EVE Online doesn’t shard and has broken over 30k online at the same time.

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  • mrrealtime

    if you dont like second life, dont visit. SL is created entirely by its community, as is You Tube and My Space and many other like sites. Some stuff that is there is amazing, a lot is crap, but its totally free and open for whatever you can imagine as a participant. If its boring or sucks, its YOUR fault because YOU make the experience. WOW and others are more like going to see a movie, you participate inside a large corporation’s idea, and dont really have to be particularly creative. SL = democratic free market.

  • mrrealtime

    also, SL has broken 42,000 concurrent recently and continues to grow rapidly. Regardless of who is “in the lead” its not a competition. SL is and will be viable for the forseeable future. SL is just a community of people…a few hundred thousand thereabouts.

  • ChazMaz

    Second Life: Land of the WEAK home of the BROKEN

    First of all, I have been there, have done that. Had clubs, owned land, made friends, money, and fell in love. Second life on the surface, especially for the newbie and Entrepreneur/artist is a fun and cool place to make some friends, and make some money. It is looked at as supercharged chat room, a video game. But the nature of its name is where the insidiousness is. As much of a second life (SL) as it might be, in order to operate you still have to use your Real Life (RL) abilities. You do not follow a different thought and emotional pattern when in SL. You can only use what you know in RL. But kidding yourself is one of the appeals of SL. You eventually get lost in it.
    At first it is new and exciting. Like a new video game. Learning the functions that move your avatar around, visiting places and socializing with the natives. You are perfect, and you can fly. No sickness, no need for money (well not as much) and people don’t have bad breath and, as a “normal”, “intelligent” person, it is an interesting place to explore and learn. But it eventually becomes one of three things. 1. Boring, like a video game you have played over and over. 2. An environment to explore your creative ability to design and sell things. Or, 3 it consumes your psyche.
    The first two are what they are; the third is the meat and potatoes of SL. This is the one that is more consistent. Do you really think the folks at Linden Labs are spending their free time on SL.? No, they are spending the money they are making in RL (SL is a business so it is RL for them) on RL things.
    There comes a saturation point where you walk away or get sucked in. I will say this for the last time and it does not apply to you newbie’s, or the smart ones that are making money off the lonely. It is a place to hide from reality. It is a place where weak, lost souls go to escape from the depth and breadth of life. I will allow some latitude for you shut-ins. Some people have nothing else but the four walls of the room they are in. SL can provide a form of “human” entertainment that they otherwise would not be able to get. But, that just causes the shut-in to let go of their emotional self being even greater. This is a hard pill to swallow, no one wants to take a good look at them selves and most do not. But the covert nature of SL allows you to cut loose. Sort of the absolute power corrupts absolutely theory. People that stay too long get lost in it. And yes, justifying all the way, that it is just a game. For the predator, and a predator is weak by nature, it is a place to be free of thought and persecution. To dominate the weak that makes SL their home. And, it is a place for the weak to not be judged, a place that they can feel and accept that who they are is ok, even if it is with the few. Some people can handle the trials and tribulations of life, some can’t and they end up in SL. You start to see a symbiotic circle of relationships in SL. For the people designing objects to sell, they may not interact totally and directly with the person/s and, their sales may come from across the board. The newbie that is playing the “game” to the obsessed, but, the obsessed is a long term customer. Theses business individuals usually get in, add new product, convert their lindens to dollars or pounds and get out.

    The tragedy is the weak and broken. Don’t roll your eyes, In the Real World we are always conned with flashy marketing to get us to buy something or believe something in order to buy a product. Magic cream or potion. Don’t kid yourself; Second Life is about making money. Making money off of what? Our loneliness and our lack of self worth in the real world. HELLO, McFly!! It is called Second Life.

    It might be simple, you build a club, people come and visit or create a group, and you solicit for members. People get together and boom, you feel wanted and needed. Building your dream home in the clouds and littering your lawn with cool things like jets and swimming pools. That can make you popular. Walking in a park with your perfect Avatar girlfriend/boyfriend, no RL issues so it is a perfect relationship. That leads to good puppet sex. Mmmm nice. All this is accomplished by tugging on your weakness, your emotional frailty. Either you are not getting it in RL or are too afraid to face the truth of how to exist in RL. You can’t handle the truth and if you are a long term SL puppet, you just can’t handle life, Real Life. Don’t get me wrong, we all like to escape from time to time.

    In some places it is much darker, like I said before, predators hunting the weak. The Gorean Master and the slaves that he takes control of. This one is unusual, in that the Master has total control over the slave. The “slave” giving not only total control of their Avatar, and who can communicate to them, but also, control as to when they will or will not talk to what they can wear. Believe me this does carry over to real life. Imagine the fun of kneeling next to your Avatar Master and saying nothing. Second life being nothing more then a place to be told what to do, serving fake food and ale. You want to call it guided, or taught? Hey, what ever floats your boat? I know just a video game, right? This setup just allows the predator to get in that persons head and develop a false sense of security. Tell that to your husband, wife, girlfriend, or boyfriend. Why you are glued to the PC instead of enjoying life, REAL LIFE. And, couples also get on there too, as couples, this is a nutty one. Worked hard all week, beautiful weekend, and, you both are on a computer, every free moment, building and designing that special home, having that child you never could have. (Yes, people do play the part of the child.) I find it unhealthy when instead of developing a better real life and real relationship in RL. You take that precious time and waste it. Yes, ok… You are free to do what you want. But there are plenty of damaged people on SL. And your fantasy could be causing them to loose sense of reality, along with your lost sense of reality. Their marriages, get funky, destroyed, their children get neglected. And you get a ridiculous God complex that makes you anti social in the Real World, which just plummets yourself deeper in to SL. Cha Ching! Sweet business you got Linden People.
    You have the 50+ couple that spends every “free” moment in SL being the King and Queen. Oh, and so good to their obedient subjects. At their beckons call, at their total command. Or, the sexual perverts. Ok, my opinion….. That can now live out the fantasy of doing it with a farm animal. Or, kneeling down and being the public toilet. Sex is rampant in SL. The anonymous nature of your avatar is something too. You really do not know if the man is a woman or the woman is a man, plenty of men that are living out their desire to be a Transsexual, or a woman. Plenty of women that want to love another woman, so she hides in the body of a man. I guess what you don’t know won’t hurt you. Hey, no one is getting hurt, no aids. Nicey nice. The soul is willing but the flesh is weak. So, the wall that SL provides, allows for an easier transition to experiment. Sad part is as your getting deeper and deeper; you are getting more lost in fantasy then reality and they start to blend. Actually, you probably were lost between the two to begin with. Now you go out into the real world. Take a break; meet one of your SL friends. Break the rule, cross that line; remember SL and RL are supposed to be two different places. People meet up, some get married, the rare few. But mostly it is a letdown, disappointment, and harm to others. It is a dirty little secret. Who wants to tell people that you got into that trouble because you decided to meet your “make believe” friend?
    Lips stay sealed, people get hurt. And in the end, the only place they feel right, the only place that people understand is right back on Second Life. CHA CHING!