Thus, a corporation probably wouldn’t need to sue somebody who is already working for them. A private citizen could attempt to sue the government… and be off-target because (1) that may just be a front for who’s really been spying on them and (2) they can’t afford the kind of legal representation they’d need to have a chance to topple their opposition.

So, under this line of speculation, it’s not so simple as to suggest the U.S.’s mechanisms of spying are identical to China’s. True, they’re both doing it out of interest to promote a healthy country, but how different their philosophies on what a healthy country is!

geldonyetich :

Hey, I wonder what you’d see if you Google “Crypto AG + Cryptogate”

Apparently that this was a feature sold to the U.S., and other countries, by a Swiss company.
So it was really more like a corporation selling to the U.S. the ability to spy on individuals.

It’s debatable whose idea it was, but the net effect is that the US was spying on the entire world, which is par for the course. I don’t mean to imply that spying on people is some how exclusive to the US, because obviously it’s not, just trying to show that any one who can cost effectively spy does it.

There are many laws on the books in the US whose purpose is to make it easier to spy on private citizens, so how can any one pretend that it’s not going on? You think the government gave itself the right to monitor you without a warrant, or banned the use of powerful encryption just on a lark?

In a world where people are trying to blow up American planes with explosive underwear, no one really wants to know how much they’re being monitored, they just want the bad guys to get caught.

Stabs :
Would Google have not allowed the Chinese security services to access gmail accounts if they had just simply asked?

Google has never hosted private user data (gmail, blogger, etc) on machines within China, specifically to keep this data outside of the jurisdiction of such requests:

Protection of user privacy — We will not maintain on Chinese soil any services, like email, that involve personal or confidential data. This means that we will not, for example, host Gmail or Blogger, our email and blogging tools, in China.

from: http://googleblog.blogspot.com/2006/02/testimony-internet-in-china.html

Hey, I wonder what you’d see if you Google “Crypto AG + Cryptogate”

Apparently that this was a feature sold to the U.S., and other countries, by a Swiss company.

So it was really more like a corporation selling to the U.S. the ability to spy on individuals.

geldonyetich :

So does no one think that the US Government hacks corporations or even private citizens on foreign soil?

I really don’t think so. If they did, the corporations would waste no time starting a media circus over it.
No, the corporations don’t sue the U.S. government for hacking them. Why should they? They own it.

Hey, I wonder what you’d see if you Google “Crypto AG + Cryptogate”

So does no one think that the US Government hacks corporations or even private citizens on foreign soil?

I really don’t think so. If they did, the corporations would waste no time starting a media circus over it.

No, the corporations don’t sue the U.S. government for hacking them. Why should they? They own it.

Isn’t there some sort of act, the “I Love My Country” act or something that authorizes law enforcement to hack or wiretap without a prior court order, largely at their own discretion, and then obtain permission after the fact?

It’s all a little bit fuzzy in my mind. I guess I’ll go watch Family Guy. That greased up deaf guy is hilarious!

Unrelated history that happened 200 years ago is irrelevent to the matter at hand. You’re saying if we can find a criminal in your ancestry, that you have no right to complain about crime. You are also saying that if we can find a criminal in your ancestry, that you share the blame for their crimes. You are merely changing the topic because you are uncomfortable and defensive.

It’s not your fault.
It’s not your fault.
It’s not your fault.
Unless of course you did it.